Capelle On Golf

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Tiger vs. Jack and the Golf Ball

April 28th, 2008 · 2 Comments

Tiger Woods’ third knee surgery and the prognosis that his knee could be an ongoing problem has thrown a monkey wrench in those predictions for 22-25+ majors. 19-20 is looking a whole lot better.

Let’s assume Tiger finishes with 19 majors at the completion of his 19th season. In the same number of seasons Nicklaus won 17 majors. From that point on, Nicklaus was far less effective due to outside interests and age, as Tiger might be. And then there’s that business with his knee.

You might think Tiger could be at a disadvantage over the later part his 19 years because of his knee until you consider Nicklaus’ history with his left hip. It became a problem early in 1963, his second season on tour, and it remained a concern throughout his career. Here’s part of what Nicklaus had to say about his hip in My Story:

“Over the years ahead, that hip tendon problem would recur more often than I have cared to publicly admit. Eventually, I figured out that it was probably caused, or at least aggravated by my right leg being about a quarter inch shorter than my left, which exerted added pressure on the left hip during the golf swing.”

Let’s call the affects of their injuries even, although we don’t know for sure what will happen with Tiger’s knee in the years ahead.

Now I’m going to throw in one variable, the golf ball. In 2000 Nike hired Rock Ishii to design the perfect ball for Tiger. Woods put Ishii’s first creation to work at the Memorial in May of 2000, which he won by five shots, and then went on to win the Tiger Slam. Considering the advances in balls and testing, and Tiger’s obsession with his equipment, he might have benefited from the ball. Certainly there is no reason to believe that a substandard ball ever cost him a major.

As for Nicklaus, a case can be made that the lousy balls he used throughout his prime cost him several majors. At least that’s the opinion of Frank Thomas, who for 26 years tested balls for the USGA. In his recently released book, Just Hit It, Thomas had this to say about the ball Nicklaus used:

“Because only a few players were using the MacGregor ball in 1977, I had to ask Jack Nicklaus and some others for samples to test. Jack gave me several sleeves from his bag, and we learned through testing with a mechanical golfer that the balls were so poor – their performance was so inconsistent – that I’m convinced he would have won several more majors if he’d used a different, better ball.”

Johnny Miller and Greg Norman have both previously voiced the same sentiment as Thomas regarding Nicklaus’ record.

Which brings us back to our argument: whose record of major titles would be better? Jack with 17, or Tiger with 19 – both after 19 seasons?

Let’s add two wins to the Nicklaus column to compensate for the lousy balls he played with. That seems fair considering that he lost 10 majors by a stroke (or less) in this period. We won’t deduct any wins from the Woods column to compensate his personal ball scientist, but Ishii’s creations might made the difference in one or two majors. And the final result? A dead heat at 19 each.

Let the debates begin!

Tags: Tiger vs. Jack

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2 responses so far ↓

  • 1 BD // Apr 30, 2008 at 12:04 pm

    Well, 19 is still clearly better than 17. I suppose one could argue that Jack’s overall record in majors would still be better because of the second-place finishes, but if it’s actual titles we’re talking about, then I don’t see how one can pronounce the guy with 17 better than the guy with 19 over the same period.

    As far as making adjustments for equipment, isn’t it the case that all of the players of Jack’s era played inferior balls? How can we say that out-of-balance balls cost HIM several majors, in particular? Might unreliable equipment have cost his competitors several majors instead?

  • 2 Brad Carter // Nov 8, 2008 at 11:34 am

    Hi,

    Jack Nicklaus vs Tiger Woods, who is better? I have to give the nod to Nicklaus. I never knew that Tiger had his own personal golf ball scientist. I guess that would be an advantage.

    Although euipment has gotten better and Tom Watson probably did beat Jack a few times because of his euipment, I give the nod to Jack because there were more great players in Nicklaus’ era then in Tigers.

    Today there are more solid players then in Jacks day. Players who can win on any given sunday except for Major Sundays were it takes a special champion to win and compete consistantly. That is why Tigers record of total wins is far more impressive then his number of Major wins were he has the stage to himself.

    Jack had great players who were proven major champions he had to compete against. Jack had to go toe to toe with Arnold Palmer at age 22 when Palmer was in his prime. When Tiger first came out he had the Major stage to himself. If it was not for Palmer, Player, Watson and Trevino, Jack would have won 30 majors.

    I like to compare golf to boxing. Everyone claims Ali was the greatest boxer that ever lived. However Lennox Lewis was bigger and stronger then Ali. So why is Ali considered the best? The answer is simple, Ali had the better competition. Ali had the epic battles with such greats as Frasier, Forman, and Norton.

    It is not the tournaments that Jack won that I remember. It was the duels with other great players. Nicklaus’ losses defined his greatness just as much as his victories. Tiger has yet to have a great battle with another great player.

    So, we are left with the question is Tiger great or is his competition just average. I think that history will ultimately conclude that Jack was the better player. In my opinion Nicklaus had to beat 5 of the all time greatest players to win his Majors.

    Brad

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